SOTR: It’s Grow or Die featuring Chris Dreyer of

Mar 18, 2022

Chris Dreyer is the Founder and CEO of, a digital marketing agency focused on SEO (search engine optimization) and helping elite personal injury law firms land serious injury and auto accident cases through Google’s organic search results. As a personal injury law firm SEO agency, they serve clients all over the country to help them win first page rankings on high-value keywords.

This was a fun Sales on the Rocks episode as we talked about house parties, Captain Morgan, sales for SEO agencies, all the way down to the meaning of life, and the things that are most dear to us. And Chris Dreyer went on the ride with us.

What’s in Joey’s glass: Jefferson’s Chateau Pichon Baron

What’s in JJ’s glass: E.H. Taylor Single Barrel

What’s in Chris’s glass: Captain Morgan Original Spiced Rum

This Cast Covers:

  • How Chris got his nickname “Captain Chris” from our mastermind anti-retreat (03:06)
  • Did Chris really get evicted for throwing huge parties back in Florida? (07:17)
  • Chris gives us a number of his lifetime poker earnings (08:37)
  • The difference between a wantrepreneur and an entrepreneur is execution (13:22)
  • How to filter good ideas from bad ones a.k.a. become a better decision-maker and implementer (15:23)
  • Why Joey likes making asymmetric bets and what he means by them (17:17)
  • How Rankings was still able to get referrals and business deals even if their digital marketing on the radio didn’t work out (18:22)
  • The one thing most agency owners don’t do that keep them from seeing massive growth in their business (19:58)
  • Three ways you can do fulfillment based on leverage and the pros and cons of each one and why Chris prefers to outsource their SDRs (22:28) 
  • The difference in hiring internal employees, a freelancer, and a vendor or strategic partner (24:24)
  • When you have leverage on that strategic partner in terms of percentage of their book that you make up or that your clients make up, that really allows you to speak into the process and have more control instead of it being low control, low maintenance (26:26)
  • How Chris was able to streamline their sales process and focus on sales in 2021 while working with an outsourced model (31:50)
  • Incremental improvements create exponential growth (33:02)
  • How Chris is able to make these incremental improvements even in outsourcing (35:55)
  • Many agency owners and founders completely just give up on outbound because they haven't figured out how to obtain trust in that sales cycle (36:39)
  • There’s a massive chasm of deal velocity between people who come inbound and people who come through outbound (39:32)
  • Strategically thinking of ways to set up your strategic partners for success so they can convert at a higher level (40:01)
  • Core versus context (41:37)
  • If people would only look at the numbers in their business, e.g. what’s the cost per booked call for your SDRs? (43:31)
  • What Chris has done in Rankings to successfully differentiate themselves from all the other agencies out there that are selling legal marketing or legal SEO and be able to charge a premium (49:46)
  • Niching is great, but hyper niching takes it to a whole ‘nother level (51:17)
  • The best way to improve your win rate is to improve your offer (54:13)
  • Is Chris fulfilled in this season of his life? Are the things he’s winning at enough? (59:24)
  • Why Chris enjoys challenges and learning constantly (1:00:36)
  • The goal is to get to a place in your life where you have optionality (1:07:58)

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